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Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:47 pm
by MagooNZ
Glad you are back Prince. The intention was that JAP would behave historically, go to war at Marco Polo event (About june/july 37?), so no early DOW on any of the Chinese factions. The rules need another tweak. Hopefully you can live with this one.
GER really does need to closely co-ordinate its builds with ITA, so I'm happy to play these two. Must blow the dust off the other PC and try a 2 player game locally for the first time, so they can be in one saved game file.
We need to decide where to put our saved game files for editing. I must discuss this with Pang. The Paradox forums have now been changed over; need a Paradox account and the old shortcuts don't work any more.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:46 pm
by princedetenebres
Alright, that's no problem. What's the correct checksum again? I need to make sure I'm playing the right version.

Rules are fine as they are I'd say; as it is moot -- the AI will annex the Chinese minors in short order by event, so no early attack is even possible. And it'd be silly to attack NatChi early itself, as you'd miss out on the benefits of the event, not to mention needing that time to build up for the ordeal.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2015 5:33 pm
by MagooNZ
Good luck with JAP prince,
Game is AoD109_C32 (vanilla JYYT), becomes ICYT with the stand ground dissent change to 0.04
record the Nanking massacre date for Insomni to trigger in his USA game.
I have played my GER/ITA game through to 06:00 hrs 1 Aug 39. With earlier saves of 30 July 39 and 1 Aug 39 00:00 hrs, available as backups.
For my final save I merged then deleted all my trade convoys, each country had 7, @ $7 each = $49 to cancel. Also removed all leaders.
So I now have my save ready for the merge.

I hope Cera (SOV) and walee (ENG) are still around, haven't heard from them for a while. Please all post here when your save is available for merging.

JAP can keep its trade convoys with all nations apart from the human countries. There is no pressure to annex CHI, since JAP will be the master file (& can keep all its leaders).

Sub Forums are now setup. I can only see the Axis subforum

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 11:20 am
by MagooNZ
Prince, how is your SP game going? With the CHI war, it will take you longer to get to 1 Aug 39. I just PM'ed Cera, walee & Insomni to see if they are still interested in playing this MP game.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 5:18 pm
by MagooNZ
This game is looking doubtful. Havent heard from Insomni since 26 March. Havent heard from walee since 5 March. There is a UK player who is interested, but if the former 2 players have both left, even with the new player we are still one short. The new UK player works night shift so is happy to play thru the night (must sleep only during the day). I'm not doing any more work preparing for SP saved game merging until we have a committed core of 5 players. In the meantime, I'm going try out the latest AoD TRM SP game.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Fri Apr 24, 2015 8:52 pm
by princedetenebres
Yeah... sorry, I figured as much. I haven't finished my game yet because I was waiting to see if the Allies were still on board; didn't see much point in carrying on if its just the two of us, both playing Axis countries. I'm still interested, but we need to have at least one more. Though I guess, I could play two Allied countries.

Bummer, I kept checking here to see if anyone besides you or me posted to this. Are you still playing in the other game that was going on? Let me know if you guys want/need another or a sub

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 3:40 pm
by Mr_B0narpte
princedetenebres wrote:Bummer, I kept checking here to see if anyone besides you or me posted to this. Are you still playing in the other game that was going on? Let me know if you guys want/need another or a sub
The other game has reached 24 September 1939, feel free to jump in as Hungary/Romania/ any Axis minor. Currently I'm Germany but Jarski& Desev have been very generous and have subbed me since the start! Desev is Italy & Jarski is Hungary, but as Jarski is subbing me, Hungary is free for the time being. Romania & all other Axis minors are permanently free - as we've been using Jarski's awesome AI, all those nations have progressed quite well.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Sun May 03, 2015 5:46 pm
by MagooNZ
Now 4 May, jarod45's last posting was 21 April. If interested in joining, would have posted in that time.
Insomni & walee have vanished without trace, as did grung....(if I recall correctly)
So we are down to only 3 players, and Cera seems busy & not able to always make the Sat WPO game that she is already in.

As a minimum; 4 players could play the majors this way: GER & smallest major ITA. SOV alone. JAP alone. ENG & USA by one player. The two single countries are up against it early on (& JAP for the whole war), so they need to fully focus on their own countries. But we don't even have four players.

It is time to say, we tried, but finding 4 - 6 Major Country multi-players for the Pacific timezone region at this time has failed. It was a good idea to merge SP games, so that the MP time commitment to reach WWII from Jan 36 start would be minimal. I am confident this can be made to work.

So to quote Gen MacArthur's famous line: "These proceedings are closed."

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon May 04, 2015 1:21 am
by Brother Lobo
MagooNZ wrote:"These proceedings are closed."
Or are they? :)

I'm interested in joining this game since it's the first one I've seen in many months that's in a favorable time slot. The only concern is I might not be able to make both Saturday and Sunday. I can do one or the other, but both may be difficult. In all honesty weekday evenings would be the best, but I'll take what I can get. Also, if this game does go forward, I may be able to convince a friend to join, but I make no guarantees.

One other thing- about this scheme to run the game years in single player and merge the saves- has this been perfected yet? I'll admit I know little about editing game files. Have edited games like this been tested for any length of time? Are they stable?

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon May 04, 2015 5:45 pm
by MagooNZ
Thanks Brother L. It is possible. I'm playing GER/ITA. Prince is JAP. Cera is SOV. Do you have two PCs so that you can play ENG/USA? I already swapped from USA to pickup up the two Axis two countries; and want to avoid everyone having to swap countries again. This balances two humans on each side (historical game).
What is your time zone (location and UTC hours)?
Prince seems more ready to play than Cera. Since you are both in the USA (I guess you are?, & Cera is definitely), communication with Cera may be a little easier for you.
It would be good to schedule two weekend sessions to improve the likelihood of getting an average of one session /wk, occasionally getting two, as well as skipping whole weekends when someone has other things to do.
If you have two PCs, then we need to review session times and give the remaining players the most suitable session time slots. Preferred days for me will probably be your Fri or Sat; since these are my Sat & Sun. Do you have summer time changeover?
Game Rules have been posted & AoD109_C32 is game variant being used. (I think its C32).
If you can play, you need to wait for JAP to tell you Nanjang massacre date, so you can fire off the USA slider move at the correct time. We play SP right thru to 1 Aug 39.
Pang has offered to help merge files. I prefer to use the JAP saved game as master as this gives the correct CHI-JAP province history; and they can still be at war. Other countries will be at peace. Fastest Spanish civil war outcome, or most closest to victory, will be put into the merged game. Merged hasn't been tried yet; but at least it is only a few fast SP sessions to get to Aug 39 (from Jan 36). So if it falls over, not so much is lost for individual players not working on the merge. I have looked into a number of aspects, and Pang has wavered between highly confident & doubtful. I have become more confident. We might not get everything 100% right (resource reallocation, I don't favour any) but the main things have been looked at. Still expect some time to lapse before MP sessions start. Anyhow, HoI IV is delayed at least another 6 months?, last time I looked. And I probably won't want to be in on day 1.
Whoever can host MP sessions should be determined by person with fastest internet connection and perhaps (min local internet traffic at session times to avoid ISP throttling).

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon May 04, 2015 10:07 pm
by Mr_B0narpte
Sorry to butt in, just my two cents: If you use the Improved 1936 mod, you won't need a human UK or Italy. The AI for both are great in terms of research and production - and obviously can be tweaked to suite the preferences of the USA and Germany players. All you would need to do is MC them when war breaks out, if not a few months beforehand. Message Jarski if you have any questions about it, he'll be more then happy to help.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Mon May 04, 2015 11:56 pm
by Brother Lobo
I'm on MST (0000 UTC - 7 hours) with no DST switch.

I have no objection to playing the USA or UK but playing both at the same time won't be possible on Gameranger since most days I'll only have access to one computer.

There is an alternative though that would allow it, and that is to have someone with (preferably a direct wired connection) to host the game via IP address. If this can be done, I (or any player) can simply run multiple copies of AOD on a single computer and connect them via IP and alt/tab between copies to control multiple countries. It sounds awkward, but I actually played a 1 vs 1 game where myself and my opponent played 5 nations each!

As far as days go, you guys who live outside the USA (where I am) will have to fill me in on what days/times we actually intend to play. The initial post said Sat/Sun 0000 UTC -0400 UTC, if this is wrong due to folks living overseas, please clarify so I can confirm my attendance.

Question: What happens to China? Is Japan simply allowed to crush AI China during the 3 1/2 years single player period? The Fall of China is a serious blow to the allies and may make things lopsided.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Tue May 05, 2015 5:59 pm
by MagooNZ
Sorry Brother Lobo, I don't have the internet skill to know how to do what you propose. So this would not be using WPO as hosting site. I only have minimal WPO AoD MP experience.

Sat/Sun 0-4 hrs UTC are midday to 4pm (same day) where I live (assuming I have looked up time zones correctly). I'm in normal winter time now, so exactly 12 hours ahead of UTC time. UK probably has summer time now so their local time will be 1am to 5am. UTC doesn't change for summer time. What is your (Brother & Cera) local time for UTC 0:00 hours? Prince is in my time zone. This proposed session time is ok for me, but I'm happy to change session times if other players prefer something else. I just dont want late night & very early morning sessions; and really need weekend sessions due to my Mon-Fri commitments. In last MP game, with an 18:00 UTC start, this was 6am (winter) or 7am (summer) local start time which was good. It meant my weekend afternoons were all free, and we only really played my Sat am session since the European players were busy doing other things their Sat nights. What local day & times do Brother & Cera prefer to play? Not sure if Cera relocated for new job. If we exchange current local time zone (related to 00:00 hrs UTC), and preferred session times, we should obtain the best compromise.

JAP can crush CHI & will likely annex, but unlike the last MP game, will not be able to release CHI as a puppet & then as independent nation. JAP will need to garrison CHI to get something out of it. Last MP game, the released CHI puppet (incorporating Manchuria to Tibet) had enormous manpower and up to date JAP technology. I am hoping that this will tone down the Axis and bring balance to the 2 sides. In last MP game, USA gave up just as USA was becoming powerful. However SOV was near collapse due to very high dissent caused by overuse of VoV; and CHI was fielding a larger & larger Axis inf army. This game, I have reduced the severity of the VoV penalty (this severe penalty is in 1.09, not in 1.08.). ENG just needs to bide its time, save the home islands, not make unnecessary sacrifices, and wait for USA. Loss of Suez, SFA, AST, Gib, India isn't that important. What is important is for SOV core industrial provinces & army to survive until the USA becomes powerful; this is the greatest challenge for the non-axis powers. No Axis CHI will help with this too.

Brother lobo, just a suggestion. If your PC hardware is in need of an upgrade?, could you bring its replacement forward so that you could have a couple of PCs available in time for the first MP session? Who knows, the first MP session may be 2 months away?

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Thu May 07, 2015 12:13 am
by Brother Lobo

I am on MST (Mountain Standard Time) which is UTC 0000 - 7 hours. So, the proposed play times 0000 to 0400 UTC would be 5 p.m. to 9 p.m. MST for me. That time slot is fine, but the ideal time would be 6 p.m. to 10 p.m. for me. I like to get things out of the way during the day and play evenings so the extra hour is just a personal preference.

The only question is what days- is 12 p.m. Saturday in (Magoo- New Zealand?) still on a Saturday where I am in the USA?.

MagooNZ wrote:Sorry Brother Lobo, I don't have the internet skill to know how to do what you propose. So this would not be using WPO as hosting site. I only have minimal WPO AoD MP experience.
Not sure you understood what I was suggesting. When I said it's possible to run multiple copies of AOD simultaneously, it is a very simple process.

1. Someone hosts a game. Under multiplayer in AOD, you select internet, then host. Then you just post your own IP address somewhere (via gameranger chat, the WPO forum etc) so other players have it. Then they can join your game by selecting internet, then entering your IP address. I only suggested that the host have a wired internet connection (not wireless) because occasionally routers/WiFi can cause connection issues for others.

2. Whichever players need to control multiple nations can install multiple copies of AOD on a single PC.

3. When it's time to play, those players would launch their copies of the game, and on each copy select a different nation and then enter the hosts IP address and connect each copy to the host's game.

4. The player running multiple copies on a single PC can easily switch back and forth between copies by using alt/tab.

C.3 Players may reduce unit salaries to no less than 10% of the maximum amount.
I want to make sure I understand this correctly- so basically 10% (of 100%) is the lowest a player can run salaries? No one can run salaries at zero?
you need to wait for JAP to tell you Nanjang massacre date, so you can fire off the USA slider move at the correct time.
OK, there are a some issues here- there are several events related to what Japan does in China. The Pitman Act and the Nanjing Massacre (Also, Operation Zet for the USSR). How does the American player prevent events from being duplicated? The AI may trigger them in single player before or after the human player can force them to fire via event ID. Also, does this mean I have to wait until the Japanese player is finished before I can even begin running my single player game?
We might not get everything 100% right (resource reallocation, I don't favour any)
Every player is going to exploit trade in single player and maximize resource gain. What does "no reallocation" mean? Does that mean we all keep whatever we gained in single player? Or does that mean everyone is reset to some arbitrary number? What? If we keep what we gained it may create a sort of resource duplication that floods the game with a massive surplus once trading resumes in multiplayer. This issue needs to be resolved.

PATCH 1.09

Does anyone know if the infamous "Naval Scroll Bug" has been fixed in this patch? Basically when a naval battle broke out, on the battle screen if you scroll any direction to see details it can crash the game. I really hate this bug.

Re: Feb 2015 AoD MP Setup

Posted: Sun May 10, 2015 5:35 pm
by MagooNZ
Thanks for yr reply Brother. No problem with shifting the proposed session time 1 hour. I will be Sat, Sun afternoon local while you will be evening Fri, Sat local.
Do those days suit? Cera is probably in your time zone.
Good explanation of internet connection option. I have hard wired but slow internet over shared phone line. Also, I cannot get AoD to play ok in windowed mode which could be a problem. Cera & Prince, do either of you have faster internet?
Yes, don't want to run below 10% of reqd military salaries (seems unrealistic to run at zero salaries during buildup).
I came up with a minor event file edit for the USA player to repeat duplicated Nanjiang event.
Will take a look at Pitman and the SOV-JAP events. Events that fire at a fixed date in time can just run as is.
You can play until July 37, then wait for date of Nanjiang M from JAP player. I believe Prince has started JAP SP game so he may have got to Nanjiang already.
I was thinking of just leaving everyone with the resources they got from SP, but Pang suggested some reallocation. I don't know the details. SPs will build more factories than AI thus consume more, but SPs wont improve infrastructure as much (decreasing available resources). Perhaps just scale all SP resource stocks back by a set % across the board.
I don't even recall a naval scroll bug.
EDIT 12 May:
Pitman is relatively minor so let it run.
Panay Incident is another USA affecting event. USA should comment out the triggering of event 81 inside event 80 (enter #). Then fire event 81 using F12 at the date provided by the JAP player.
EDIT 13 May:
You are right Brother. Some resource or equiv $ / supplies reduction should be applied due to AI countries consuming less resources thus having more to trade with SP game human players. If it was an all human major player game, resources would be in short supply thus cost more to buy or just not be available.